[Vision2020] Air Force Boots Top Aviator
Andreas Schou
ophite at gmail.com
Thu May 21 17:33:51 PDT 2009
On this issue, I'm going to side with Gary on the numbers. Kinsey had some
serious methodological issues, and as his fame (or, at the time, I guess
you'd have called it notoriety) grew, the number of respondents that
intentionally sought him out because they had a particular sociological axe
to grind also grew. Exclusively gay and lesbian Americans are a relatively
small minority; a small minority that should not be denied any particular
rights any more than Laotian immigrants should be denied any particular
rights.
-- ACS
On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 5:13 PM, g. crabtree <jampot at roadrunner.com> wrote:
> Funny. Your ursine pal quotes from the same study I cited (The Social
> Organization of Sexuality: Sexual Practices in the United States - Laumann,
> Gagnon, Michael, Michaels) as well as the hugely discredited Kinsey report
> in a failed attempt to bear up his spurious assertion of 10% of America's
> population being gay and yet you find my numbers...curious. Could it be that
> Yogi's numbers "look better" because they more closely match up with your
> preconceived notions?
>
> g
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Campbell" <
> philosopher.joe at gmail.com>
> To: <bear at moscow.com>
> Cc: "g. crabtree" <jampot at roadrunner.com>; <bear at moscow.com>; "Tom Hansen"
> <thansen at moscow.com>; "Moscow Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2009 8:02 AM
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Air Force Boots Top Aviator
>
> > This looks better.
> >
> > The Crabtree information, including the citation, is in quotes,
> > indicating it was lifted from a website or whatever. I wonder where it
> > came from.
> >
> > You're right, though, Bear the percentage is irrelevant.
> > Discrimination is wrong regardless of the percentage. But the Crabtree
> > numbers are ... curious.
> >
> >
> >
> > Joe Campbell
> >
> > On May 21, 2009, at 7:33 AM, bear at moscow.com wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> I think we are trying to count how many angels can dance on the head
> >> of a
> >> pin, and depending on what study you use, the numbers vary.
> >>
> >> The bottom line is, they have a right to serve, let them!
> >>
> >> The average ratio from several studies are that 9.37% of men are
> >> homosexual and 4.87% of women are homosexual in the US. The Central
> >> Intelligence Agency estimates that there are 149,346,264 men and
> >> 154,478,382 women in the US which would statistically equate to
> >> 13,993,745
> >> gay men & 7,523,097 lesbians in the US for a total of just over 21.5
> >> Million.
> >>
> >> In 1995, a survey (The prevalence of homosexual behavior and
> >> attraction in
> >> the United States, the United Kingdom and France: Results of national
> >> population-based samples - Sell, Wells, and Wypij) reported 6.2% of
> >> males
> >> and 3.6% of females in the United States report having had sexual
> >> contact
> >> with someone of the same sex in the previous 5 years.
> >>
> >> A 1994 study (The Social Organization of Sexuality: Sexual Practices
> >> in
> >> the United States - Laumann, Gagnon, Michael, Michaels) reported
> >> that the
> >> incidence rate of homosexual desire for men is 7.7% and 7.5% for
> >> women.
> >>
> >> A 1993 study (The Janus Report on Sexual Behavior - Janus and Janus)
> >> found
> >> 9% of men and 5% of women were involved in frequent or ongoing
> >> homosexual
> >> experiences.
> >>
> >> A 1990 study (Homosexuality/Heterosexuality by McWhirter, Sanders, and
> >> Reinisch) stated 13.95% of males and 4.25% of females had
> >> "extensive" or
> >> "more than incidental" homosexual experience.
> >>
> >> The Indiana University Kinsey Reports (Sexual Behavior in the Human
> >> Male -
> >> Kinsey, Pomeroy, and Martin/Sexual Behavior in the Human Female -
> >> Kinsey,
> >> Pomeroy, Martin, and Gerhard) reported 10% of males being more or less
> >> exclusively homosexual and 2% to 6% of females being more or less
> >> exclusively homosexual.
> >>
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>> Where is this from?
> >>>
> >>> Joe Campbell
> >>>
> >>> On May 21, 2009, at 6:14 AM, "g. crabtree" <jampot at roadrunner.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> "1.51% of the total U.S. population identifies themselves as gay,
> >>>> lesbian or bisexual, or 4.3 total million Americans. These numbers
> >>>> are based on figures provided by a broad-based coalition of gay
> >>>> rights organizations and homosexual advocacy groups. The primary
> >>>> source cited was the The National Health and Social Life Survey
> >>>> (NHSLS), published in the book The Social Organization of Sex:
> >>>> Sexual Practices in the United States (1994), by Laumann, Gagnon,
> >>>> Michael and Michaels. "
> >>>>
> >>>> And,
> >>>>
> >>>> "Referring to the Laumann study, the gay rights coalition stated
> >>>> that in the United States 2.8% of males age 18 or older, and 1.4% of
> >>>> females age 18 or older are homosexual, gay, lesbian or bisexual. We
> >>>> have applied their figures to the 2003 U.S. population (284,800,000
> >>>> total population, according to the U.S. Census Bureau). 0.9% of
> >>>> women identify themselves as lesbians (excluding bisexuals), which
> >>>> equates to 0.32% of total U.S. population being lesbians. 2 percent
> >>>> of men identify themselves as gay (excluding bisexuals), which
> >>>> equates to 0.7% of total U.S. population being gay men. Source:
> >>>> National study published in Laumann, et al., The Social Organization
> >>>> of Sex: Sexual Practices in the United States (1994)"
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> g
> >>>> ----- Original Message -----
> >>>> From: <bear at moscow.com>
> >>>> To: "Tom Hansen" <thansen at moscow.com>
> >>>> Cc: "Moscow Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> >>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2009 7:21 PM
> >>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Air Force Boots Top Aviator
> >>>>
> >>>>> Tom,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Honestly the only way that we can put a number on it is based on
> >>>> the fact
> >>>>> that a nations military forces reflects the statistics of that
> >>>> nation. It
> >>>>> is estimated that about 10% of the US population is gay,
> >>>> therefore, it
> >>>>> safe to make the assumption that some where around 6,000 of those
> >>>> on the
> >>>>> Wall were gay (5, 819.5 for those of you out there doing the math).
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Even more interesting when you look at those numbers based on WW2
> >>>> troop
> >>>>> numbers, and really more revealing when you consider that there
> >>>> have been
> >>>>> 3,465 Medal of Honor winners, resulting in 346 gay Medal of Honor
> >>>> winners.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I had an old First Sergeant that used to tell our troops, that one
> >>>> in
> >>>>> three people in America has some sort of psychological problem. So
> >>>> in this
> >>>>> formation, look to your left, and look to your right, and if those
> >>>> two
> >>>>> guys look OK, it's YOU!
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> I have asked this question before, and it bears repeating again
> >>>> coupled
> >>>>>> with serious concern.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> There are 58,195 names on the Vietnam Memorial Wall.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> How many, would you estimate, belong to gay soldiers, sailors,
> >>>> airmen, and
> >>>>>> marines?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Pro patria,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Tom Hansen
> >>>>>> Moscow, Idaho
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> "Patriotism is not a short and frenzied outburst of emotion but
> >>>>>> the
> >>>>>> tranquil and steady dedication of a lifetime."
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> -- Adlai E. Stevenson, Jr.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> =======================================================
> >>>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> >>>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> >>>>>> http://www.fsr.net
> >>>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com <Vision2020 at moscow.com>
> >>>>>> =======================================================
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> =======================================================
> >>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> >>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> >>>>> http://www.fsr.net
> >>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com <Vision2020 at moscow.com>
> >>>>> =======================================================
> >>>>>
> >>>> =======================================================
> >>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> >>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> >>>> http://www.fsr.net
> >>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com <Vision2020 at moscow.com>
> >>>> =======================================================
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
> =======================================================
> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> http://www.fsr.net
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> =======================================================
>
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