[Vision2020] Same sex marriage

[Joe Campbell]

Of all the things I've ever done in my life, performing weddings is
the one thing I feel most comfortable doing. I'm not sure why but it
always gives me a focus that I can't sustain in any other endeavor,
even teaching (the second best thing I do). And all the weddings I've
done so far were of the ho-hum variety. In spite of my recent
experience, I still believe in the sacred sanctity of marriage as a
blessed union of two becoming one. So feel free to pass my name and
email along!

I've overstayed my welcome, so I'm off for the evening. I won't post
when school starts and I'm thankful for this indulgence.

Best, Joe

On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 11:07 PM, Scott Dredge <scooterd408 at hotmail.com> wrote:
> I might have a job for you Joe.  My brother-in-law is getting married in
> September in Lewiston and his fiance just posted this on Facebook 8 hours
> ago:
>
> Well everything is coming along good for the wedding, but we need to find
> someone to marry us. Does anyone know a anyone we could ask, we arent apart
> of any church, but i dont know any ministers or pastors that will do it
> without being part of the church, we are will pay. Any suggestions? Thanks
> in advance!
>
> Like · Dislike · · 8 hours ago via mobile ·
>
>
> Note that this is a ho-hum opposite sex wedding.  I was really hoping that
> they would move their wedding later out in the month to Saturday September
> 22 at night so I could catch the Idaho / Wyoming football game when I come
> to town.  But the two of them tend to not give me the time of day, so I
> think they're just going to do what's in their own selfish interest. :)
>
> -Scott
>
>
>> Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2012 22:52:20 -0700
>
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Same sex marriage
>> From: philosopher.joe at gmail.com
>> To: scooterd408 at hotmail.com
>> CC: godshatter at yahoo.com; vision2020 at moscow.com
>
>>
>> Good post. I'm sorry but I'm in a "philosophical" mood, so I've got to
>> challenge everything.
>>
>> Is there anyone who thinks that "churches should be forced to perform
>> same sex weddings against their beliefs"? Suppose you want to get
>> married by a Catholic priest. I image that one might accommodate you.
>> But does that force anything upon the Catholic Church?
>>
>> As I said, I have performed marriages and I'm willing to do it again
>> (just contact me if you're interested). And if you'd like a religious
>> ceremony, I can accommodate. But I'd hate to think that by doing so,
>> I'd be forcing any particular church to do anything; I'd hate to think
>> that my actions had anything to do with any particular church at all,
>> even the church of which I am (through my online degree) a minister.
>> Joe
>>
>> On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 10:38 PM, Scott Dredge <scooterd408 at hotmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > Thanks for the response anyway Paul - I was really hoping you could just
>> > try
>> > your best to take the indefensible side of keeping same sex marriage
>> > bans in
>> > place. I've racked my brain trying to think of even a single solitary -
>> > even a stretch - of a reason to continue denying same sex couples and
>> > families with same sex parents equal rights / benefits / protections of
>> > married couples and I continue to just come up blank so I'm disappointed
>> > that no one could step forward and enlighten me.
>> >
>> > In short, can anyone explain why same couples don't deserve to be as
>> > equally
>> > miserable as married couples? Also, for folks who are bent out of shape
>> > about homo sex, the best way to get people to completely stop having sex
>> > would be to encourage them to get married. Thus, same sex marriage is a
>> > win
>> > for everyone although I don't believe that churches should be forced to
>> > perform same sex weddings against their beliefs.
>> >
>> > -Scott
>> >
>> >
>> > ________________________________
>> > Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2012 20:22:20 -0700
>> > From: godshatter at yahoo.com
>> > To: scooterd408 at hotmail.com
>> > CC: kmmos1 at frontier.com; vision2020 at moscow.com
>> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Same sex marriage
>> >
>> > On 07/15/2012 06:28 PM, Scott Dredge wrote:
>> >
>> > Paul / Gary - can either of you give it a shot at playing devil's
>> > advocate?
>> > And by that, I mean a good shot, not just some half assed, weak,
>> > grasping at
>> > straws attempt.
>> >
>> > -Scott
>> >
>> >
>> > I really can't. If I had to attack gay marriage, I would do it by
>> > attacking
>> > the very concept of marriage as a whole. It's a religious institution
>> > that
>> > has no place in a presumed secular society. It's formed straight out of
>> > tradition, and the world has moved on. Every secular benefit given to
>> > married couples should be individually scrutinized in order to determine
>> > if
>> > it could in fact be given out to others as well as married couples. Why
>> > shouldn't your best friend be able to make medical decisions on your
>> > behalf
>> > if you are incapacitated, if it's been setup that way before-hand? Why
>> > shouldn't any number of people be able to sign up to jointly care for a
>> > child, receiving tax benefits in exchange? And so on.
>> >
>> > Gay marriages would be just as wrong as... non-gay marriages.
>> >
>> > Paul
>> >
>> > ________________________________
>> > Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2012 10:46:06 -0700
>> > From: kmmos1 at frontier.com
>> > To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Same sex marriage
>> >
>> > On 7/15/2012 4:37 AM, Donovan Arnold wrote:
>> >
>> > Sorry, Ken, but that is one of the silliest arguments I have heard.
>> > Marriage
>> > has nothing to do with if people have children or not.
>> >
>> >
>> > Marriage has to do with, among other things, with whether people have
>> > social
>> > permission to procreate. Same-sex marriage implies such permission is
>> > not
>> > granted to individuals within that relationship.
>> >
>> > You can be married and have no children and be not married and have 10
>> > children.
>> >
>> >
>> > Of course. Physical biology is not prevented by marriage or its absence.
>> >
>> > Many same sex couples can, do, will, and want to have children, and make
>> > damn good parents too.
>> >
>> >
>> > Likewise true.
>> >
>> > It is actually easier to have more children if you are NOT in a
>> > monogamous
>> > relationship for both genders.
>> >
>> >
>> > If a person lacks a spouse who would disapprove of extramarital
>> > sexuality,
>> > and if that person cares not whether pregnancy results from personal
>> > sexual
>> > activity, then more children may result.
>> >
>> > A man is more able to impregnate more women, and a woman would be more
>> > likely to get pregnant with more men.
>> >
>> >
>> > Marriage may have a counter-intuitive prophylactic effect as a result of
>> > each partner encouraging more responsibility from the other without
>> > regard
>> > to partner gender.
>> >
>> > More irresponsible, less thoughtful, people may cause more pregnancies
>> > without regard to partner gender if they are not monogamous. If they are
>> > monogamous fewer pregnancies will result within same-sex couples,
>> > whether or
>> > not they are married.
>> >
>> > People should not, or be socially engineered to marry a person of a
>> > gender
>> > they are not attracted to, that is unfair to one or both of them.
>> >
>> >
>> > I am not suggesting unwanted marriage. Remaining single is just as
>> > available
>> > an option.
>> >
>> > As well as others that could be deprived of their true affections and
>> > love.
>> >
>> > Marriage should ALWAYS be about two consenting adults who love each
>> > other.
>> >
>> >
>> > How romantic. And in many cases, how unrealistic. Over the centuries
>> > marriage has more often been an arrangement implementing social
>> > practicalities rather than love. Given the intractable societal burdens
>> > of
>> > overpopulation, societal concerns may well trump personal preferences
>> > for
>> > multiple reasons -- food sharing, housing sharing, and many facets of
>> > more
>> > efficient societal use of many limited resources.
>> >
>> > And nothing else. People deserve nothing less.
>> >
>> >
>> > Whether or not our current mixture of preferences will survive
>> > increasing
>> > population pressures is both uncertain and unlikely.
>> >
>> >
>> > Ken
>> >
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>> >
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