[Vision2020] Fw: Mr. Paul's Discredited Campaign

Tue Jan 3 14:10:33 PST 2012

But Tom didn't suggest that. He merely gave a single example in which such
a promise was broken. That's like say that by giving my son a dollar I'm
"suggesting" that he's only worth a dollar. Or by saying you just gave a
fallacy I'm "suggesting" that liberals have never given fallacies. You'd
have to read something into these comments to get those results. It wasn't
suggested -- that is, logically implied -- by what Tom said.

Nor is Tom committing a "failure" by not pointing out criticisms that you
enjoy. Anymore than you commit a "failure" by not noting that some
conservatives are racists, or pedophiles, or one-legged drunks who can
whistle show tunes through their nose. You're too intelligent not to get
the point I"m making.

On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 12:00 PM, Jay Borden <jborden at datawedge.com> wrote:

> No, I’m suggesting that TOM is suggesting that Republicans are the only
> ones who break campaign promises.****
>
> ** **
>
> If pointing out that a failure to keep a campaign promise extends well
> beyond party affiliation is “claptrap”… well, OK… I guess I’m full of it.*
> ***
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> Jay****
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* Joe Campbell [mailto:philosopher.joe at gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Tuesday, January 03, 2012 11:26 AM
> *To:* Jay Borden
> *Cc:* Tom Hansen; lfalen; vision 2020
>
> *Subject:* Re: [Vision2020] Fw: Mr. Paul's Discredited Campaign****
>
> ** **
>
> So you' re now suggesting that liberals are the only ones who suggest that
> Republicans are the only ones who break campaign promises? ****
>
> Boy did I miss pointing out how absurd some of this conservative claptrap
> is!****
>
> ** **
>
> But don't worry. Unlike Keely I'm not really back. Just having some fun
> before school starts.****
>
>
> On Jan 3, 2012, at 11:19 AM, "Jay Borden" <jborden at datawedge.com> wrote:**
> **
>
> So… you’re now suggesting that Republicans are the only ones that break
> campaign promises?  ****
>
>  ****
>
> I’m sure that with the tiniest of digging, anyone can find scores of
> examples across the board… and throughout history…. of politicians that
> didn’t fulfill their assurances to the public while on the campaign trail.
> ****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
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> Jay****
>
>  ****
>
> *From:* Tom Hansen [mailto:thansen at moscow.com]
> *Sent:* Tuesday, January 03, 2012 10:50 AM
> *To:* lfalen
> *Cc:* Jay Borden; Sunil Ramalingam; vision 2020
> *Subject:* Re: [Vision2020] Fw: Mr. Paul's Discredited Campaign****
>
>  ****
>
> Roger Falen urges:****
>
>  ****
>
> "If you make a campaign promise, keep it."****
>
>
>
>
> ****
>
> Ya mean like like the promise, made by the GOP in November '10, of jobs,
> Jobs, JOBS under a new Republican-majority House of Representatives, Mr.
> Falen?
>
>
> ****
>
> Seeya later, Moscow.****
>
>  ****
>
> Tom Hansen****
>
> Spokane, Washington****
>
>  ****
>
> "If not us, who?****
>
> If not now, when?"****
>
>  ****
>
> - Unknown****
>
>
> On Jan 3, 2012, at 10:38 AM, lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com> wrote:****
>
> Nethercurt was a conservatism state legislator from spokane. He campaigned
> on term limits, saying that he would only run for one term. He then changed
> his mind  and ran for another term and was defeated. Rightly so. If you
> make a campaign promise, keep it. Helen Chenowith also campaigned on term
> liments. She quit when she said she would.
> Roger
> -----Original message-----
> From: "Jay Borden" jborden at datawedge.com
> Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2011 23:13:46 -0800
> To: "Sunil Ramalingam" sunilramalingam at hotmail.com
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Fw: Mr. Paul's Discredited Campaign
>
>
>
> ****
>
> No, I don't recall George Nethercutt.  (I Googled him to see if I could***
> *
>
> learn more... but nothing really stands out as far as his record).****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
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> Since (according to the interwebs) he was a Republican, I can only****
>
> assume that he rubbed left-leaning folks the wrong way in his****
>
> politics... perhaps under the guise of "term limits". ****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
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>  ****
>
> (If I'm missing something major (like he became infamous for driving the**
> **
>
> dodo bird to extinction or something), please send me more information****
>
> before the public lambasting begins).   I only moved back here to Moscow**
> **
>
> in 2005 ... so anything local at the time surrounding him I probably****
>
> missed.****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
> Of course, the Achille's Heel in the "term limits" plan is that we would**
> **
>
> have to take a potential politician at their word...  I suppose my****
>
> larger point was that if we truly want a government that represents the***
> *
>
> people, then we *all* should set aside whatever individual****
>
> beliefs/agendas that we have and focus on that single issue:  that a****
>
> representative cannot hold office for longer than X terms.  Congeal****
>
> around THAT issue and get it done... and then we can return to our****
>
> megaload riots and NASCAR races.****
>
>  ****
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>  ****
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> Jay****
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>  ****
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>  ****
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>  ****
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> From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com****
>
> [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] On Behalf Of Sunil Ramalingam****
>
> Sent: Friday, December 30, 2011 2:02 PM****
>
> Cc: vision 2020****
>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Fw: Mr. Paul's Discredited Campaign****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
> Jay,****
>
>  ****
>
> Remember George Nethercutt? He's a good reason not to apply your****
>
> standard. I think we'd better know all their positions before voting****
>
> them in because they say they're for term limits.****
>
>  ****
>
> Sunil****
>
>  ****
>
> ________________________________****
>
>  ****
>
> Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2011 11:02:49 -0800****
>
> From: jborden at datawedge.com****
>
> To: godshatter at yahoo.com; deco at moscow.com****
>
> CC: Vision2020 at moscow.com****
>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Fw: Mr. Paul's Discredited Campaign****
>
>  ****
>
> I've been a proponent of term limits for... well, forever.  We limit the**
> **
>
> number of terms for our President, we need to limit the terms in our****
>
> House and Senate.   Having people in office for *decades* does nothing****
>
> but consolidate power and invite corruption.****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
> If you *truly* want representation in America, we have to rotate through**
> **
>
> our elected representatives... frequently.   ****
>
>  ****
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>  ****
>
>  ****
>
> To do this, Americans are going to have to put aside all other opinions***
> *
>
> until this is achieved.  Environment?  Abortion?  Taxes?  Left-handed****
>
> dentists?  All of these items need to be tabled, and the *one question****
> *
>
> that needs to be asked of a candidate is "Will you introduce and vote****
>
> for term limits?"  It needs to be the *only* reason to vote for a****
>
> candidate, and until the goal is accomplished, it needs to be the****
>
> *only*reason that a candidate is voted FOR.****
>
>  ****
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>  ****
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>  ****
>
> THEN, when term limits come to fruition... when our elected****
>
> representatives cannot stay in office and continue to consolidate power***
> *
>
> and control... then we can dust off our beliefs and take them to a****
>
> government that is as elastic as the population it represents.****
>
>  ****
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> Jay****
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>  ****
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>  ****
>
> From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com****
>
> [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] On Behalf Of Paul Rumelhart****
>
> Sent: Friday, December 30, 2011 9:47 AM****
>
> To: Art Deco****
>
> Cc: Vision2020 at moscow.com****
>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Fw: Mr. Paul's Discredited Campaign****
>
>  ****
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>  ****
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>  ****
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>  ****
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> If he does what I think he'll do if he gets into office, he'll veto****
>
> anything that he finds to be unconstitutional.  This will, at the very****
>
> least, help stop abuses like the Patriot Act and increases in funding****
>
> for DHS.  Even if Congress can come up with enough votes to override the**
> **
>
> veto, issues like this will suddenly be at the forefront of the****
>
> "national conversation" about what's going on in government.  For this****
>
> alone, I'd like to see him get in there.****
>
>  ****
>
> Paul****
>
>  ****
>
> On 12/30/2011 09:29 AM, Art Deco wrote: ****
>
>  ****
>
> I agree with Rumelhart to the extent that things in this country [and****
>
> globally] are broken beyond the traditional politicians' ways of****
>
> repairing them.  We need bold, realistic, non-poll-driven leaders who****
>
> can convince us to re-evaluate our situation, offer feasible solutions,***
> *
>
> and to convince us to make the inevitable selfless sacrifices necessary.**
> **
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>  ****
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>  ****
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> Though not traditional, I do not think Ron Paul is one of those leaders.**
> **
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>  ****
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>  ****
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>  ****
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> His view of the world and his positions are too simplistic for the****
>
> complex, diverse, globally competitive world we live in.  The latest****
>
> revelations have shown that his integrity does not rise above the****
>
> minimum standard.  The simplicity of his views are his main attraction****
>
> to many, but reality is the barricade to his views ever producing****
>
> workable solutions -- they would be even more disastrous than the messes**
> **
>
> we now face.****
>
>  ****
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>  ****
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>  ****
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> In addition, some of his views are so abhorrent and/or crackpotty that****
>
> he would not be likely to convince congress to implement them in the****
>
> face of public opinion.****
>
>  ****
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>  ****
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>  ****
>
> Having said that, I am unable to suggest any leader or group of leaders***
> *
>
> that seem capable of fixing things.  The best I can hope for is that we***
> *
>
> elect the lesser of the evils, at least by a little, to struggle on.****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
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>  ****
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> I'm glad I'm old and not likely to live too much longer.  I don't not****
>
> want to see the result of where the world is heading and the foolishness**
> **
>
> of those in power resisting what needs to be done to change that****
>
> direction.****
>
>  ****
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>  ****
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>  ****
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> w.****
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>  ****
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>  ****
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>  ****
>
> From: Sunil Ramalingam <mailto:sunilramalingam at hotmail.com<sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
> Sent: Friday, December 30, 2011 7:54 AM****
>
>  ****
>
> Cc: vision 2020 <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com <vision2020 at moscow.com>>  **
> **
>
>  ****
>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Fw: Mr. Paul's Discredited Campaign****
>
>  ****
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>  ****
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>  ****
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> Why doesn't the NYT address Paul's stances on foreign policy? On defense**
> **
>
> spending?****
>
>  ****
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> Sunil****
>
>  ****
>
> ________________________________****
>
>  ****
>
> Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2011 20:38:24 -0800****
>
> From: godshatter at yahoo.com****
>
> To: deco at moscow.com****
>
> CC: Vision2020 at moscow.com****
>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Fw: Mr. Paul's Discredited Campaign****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
> I'm beginning to believe that Ron Paul is our only hope to stop the****
>
> downslope this country is on.  For example, the Transportation Security***
> *
>
> Administration just got an extra $7.85 billion in funding for 2012,****
>
> including several hundred million dollars of funding for whole body****
>
> imagers.  This passed both the House and the Senate.  Does anyone here****
>
> actually believe that terrorism is a personally actionable danger?  Do****
>
> you change your behavior at all due to the threat?  Do you think all the**
> **
>
> security theater is worth the money?****
>
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