[Vision2020] [more] Look See What Tri-State is Promoting . . .
Paul Rumelhart
godshatter at yahoo.com
Sun Aug 12 18:29:03 PDT 2012
On 08/12/2012 02:50 PM, Sunil Ramalingam wrote:
> I think that possibility is about as slim as Paul's suggestion that
> someone with a CCW permit and a weapon may have stopped the bloodshed
> at Aurora.
That wasn't actually a suggestion. It was more along the lines of "I
wonder what I would do if I had a concealed weapon and the Aurora thing
went down". But everybody took it for a call to arms or something. I
still don't know what I would have done. I remember Robert Heinlein in
one of books talking about how it's sometimes best to go into a
dangerous area armed with a knife rather than a gun. The thinking is
that the gun makes you too careless, the knife makes you far more
careful. In the same vein, I've heard it said that it's safer to use a
sharp knife than a dull one. The sharp knife demands respect lest you
cut yourself accidentally, the dull knife does not. But you can still
cut yourself with a dull knife. Ignoring the politics, what do others think?
Paul
>
> But I've heard the argument made at CCW classes that it's responsible
> people who apply for such permits and who actually carry legally.
> While I generally agree that most people with permits are law-abiding,
> the fact is that there isn't any fool-proof way to make sure that only
> people who will use weapons responsibly will actually receive such
> permits.
>
> I say this as someone who supports such permits. But I don't think
> that the training you need to get one in any way makes the average
> permit holder capable of taking on someone like the guy in Aurora and
> stopping him; I think that's just a fantasy.
>
> Sunil
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> From: thansen at moscow.com
> Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2012 13:01:59 -0700
> To: godshatter at yahoo.com
> CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] [more] Look See What Tri-State is Promoting
> . . .
>
> Very, very possibly . . .
>
> Since he could not carry his weapon concealed, he may possibly have
> been arrested earlir for carrying a concealed weapon without a permit.
>
> Seeya round town, Moscow.
>
> Tom Hansen
> Moscow, Idaho
>
> "We're a town of about 23,000 with 10,000 college students. The
> college students are not very active in local elections (thank
> goodness!)."
>
> - Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)
>
> On Aug 12, 2012, at 12:56 PM, Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com
> <mailto:godshatter at yahoo.com>> wrote:
>
>
> Do you think his not having a concealed handgun permit would have
> stopped this tragedy? Honest question, not a "zinger".
>
> Paul
>
> On 08/12/2012 12:28 PM, Tom Hansen wrote:
>
> Courtesy of the Huffington Post at:
>
> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/josh-sugarmann/seattle-mass-shooting-lat_b_1563392.html
> -----------------------------------
>
>
> Seattle Mass Shooting Latest by a Concealed Handgun Permit
> Holder
>
> Posted: 06/01/2012 3:20 pm
>
> Another day, another mass shooting committed by a private
> citizen legally allowed to carry a concealed, loaded handgun
> in public.
>
> This time it was 40-year-old Ian Stawicki
> <http://www.seattlepi.com/local/article/Police-Seattle-shootings-were-like-an-execution-3599900.php#ixzz1wYVmZm5l>,
> who entered a Seattle cafe on Wednesday and opened fire,
> killing four people. He then left Cafe Racer, killing another
> person during a carjacking before taking his own life.
>
> The pro-gun reaction to this most recent slaughter by a
> concealed handgun permit holder? That's life.
>
> As pro-gun advocate Dave Workman, a loyal foot soldier in the
> pro-gun publishing and lobbying empire of convicted felon Alan
> Gottlieb explained <http://kuow.org/program.php?id=26924> to
> local NPR affiliate KUOW:
>
> "I don't know that there's anything you can do in these
> situations. We can't treat him like a child, he's got his
> own life to live and he can make his own mistakes no
> matter how horrific those mistakes turn out to be."
>
> "Those mistakes" happen all too often. According to a running
> tally <http://www.vpc.org/ccwkillers.htm> maintained by my
> organization, the Violence Policy Center
> <http://www.vpc.org/index.htm>, since May 2007, nearly 450
> people have been killed in 334 non-self defense incidents by
> private citizens legally allowed to carry concealed handguns.
>
> Not including this week's attack in Seattle, 20 of those
> incidents have been mass shootings of three victims or more,
> resulting in the deaths of 89 innocent victims.
>
> Listed below, they run the gamut from family annihilators to
> workplace shooters, murder-suicides to attempted political
> assassination:
>
> * In July 2011, in Texas, Tan Do, 35, opened fire at his
> son's 11th birthday party being held at the Forum Roller
> World in Grand Prairie, Texas, killing the boy's mother
> and four members of her family before taking his own life.
> * In June 2011, in Arizona, Carey H. Dyess, 73, went on an
> hours-long shooting rampage in two communities, killing
> five before taking his own life.
> * In January 2011, in Arizona, Jared Lee Loughner, 22,
> opened fire at a "Congress on Your Corner" constituent
> event held by Arizona U.S. Representative Gabrielle
> Giffords outside a Tucson Safeway supermarket. Loughner
> killed six people, including a federal judge and a
> nine-year-old girl, and injured 13, including Giffords,
> who was shot once the face.
> * In August 2010, in Connecticut, Omar Thornton, 34, went on
> a shooting rampage at the beer distributorship where he
> worked, killing eight co-workers before taking his own life.
> * In June 2010, in Florida, Gerardo Regalado, 38, committed
> Hialeah, Florida's worst mass shooting: killing four women
> and wounding three others at the Yoyito Cafe-Restaurant.
> * In March 2010, in Tennessee, Michael Joe Hood, 49, shot
> and killed his sister Susan Hood Binkley, 44, her
> ex-husband Dale Binkley, 42, and their 13-year-old son
> Jackson Binkley.
> * In January 2010, in Virginia, Christopher Speight
> allegedly shot and killed eight people including his
> sister and her husband, their 15-year-old daughter and
> four-year-old son, as well as two teenagers aged 15 and 16.
> * In December 2009, in Utah, Justin Matern shot and killed
> his wife and two sons, ages six and four, before turning
> the gun on himself.
> * On Thanksgiving Day 2009, in Florida, Paul Michael Merhige
> allegedly opened fire at his family's Thanksgiving dinner
> shooting six relatives, killing four. The deceased victims
> were his twin sisters (one of whom was pregnant), his
> 76-year-old aunt, and a six-year-old cousin. As he left
> the scene, Merhige was quoted by one witness as saying, "I
> have been waiting 20 years for this."
> * In November 2009, in North Carolina, William Maxwell shot
> and killed his wife Kathryn and their teenage children
> Conner and Cameron before killing himself.
> * In August 2009, in Pennsylvania, George Sodini, 48, opened
> fire at an LA Fitness Center in Collier, Pennsylvania,
> killing three women and wounding nine others before
> turning the gun on himself.
> * In April 2009, in Pennsylvania, white supremacist Richard
> Poplawski shot and killed police officers Stephen Mayhle,
> Paul Sciullo, and Eric Kelly while injuring another.
> * In March 2009, in Alabama, Michael McLendon, a
> self-proclaimed survivalist, killed his mother at their
> family home, beginning a shooting rampage that stretched
> across 24 miles. By the time McLendon took his own life in
> the midst of a police shootout at a factory where he had
> previously worked, he had shot four more relatives,
> including his 74-year-old grandmother, and five strangers,
> including the wife and 18-month-old daughter of a local
> sheriff's deputy.
> * In February 2009, in New York, Frank Garcia opened fire
> with a .40 Glock pistol in the Lakeside Memorial Hospital
> parking lot in Brockport, NY. He had recently been fired
> by the hospital. He shot three people there, killing two,
> before killing a married couple at their home in Canandaigua.
> * In September 2008, in Michigan, Troy Brake, 31, shot to
> death 52-year-old Sharmaine Zimmer, her sons, Tyler, 17,
> and Jeremy, 20, and beat to death Jeremy's girlfriend,
> university student Katherine Brown, 18.
> * In May 2008, in Virginia, Aaron Poseidon Jackson, 24, shot
> and killed his two children, one-year-old Aaron Neptune
> Jackson and two-year-old Nicole Aaron Jackson, and their
> mother Latasha Nicole Thomas, before taking his own life.
> * In March 2008, in Georgia, former substitute teacher
> Charles Johnston entered Doctors Hospital in Columbus,
> Georgia, carrying three handguns: a .32, a 380, and a 9mm.
> Johnson allegedly killed two people in the hospital and a
> victim in the parking lot.
> * In September 2007, in Florida, Guillermo Zarabozo and
> another man hired a charter boat, later killing the boat's
> crew of four. Zarabozo was found guilty of the four murders.
> * In July 2007, in Ohio, firefighter Terrance Hough Jr. used
> a 40 caliber pistol to shoot and kill neighbor Jacob
> Feichtner as well as Bruce Anderson and Katherine Rosby as
> a result of a dispute over fireworks the three were
> setting off on the Fourth of July. Hough also shot and
> injured two others. Hough's fellow firefighters described
> him as a "ticking time bomb that finally exploded."
> * In May 2007, in Idaho, Jason Kenneth Hamilton, a member of
> the white supremacist group Aryan Nation, shot and killed
> his wife, a police officer, and a church sexton, and
> wounded three others before turning the gun on himself in
> a shooting spree in Moscow, Idaho. Hamilton had a
> concealed handgun permit "despite a [previous] domestic
> violence conviction that should have barred him from
> owning guns.
> <http://www.vpc.org/fact_sht/ccwlawenforcement.pdf>"
>
> Because most states don't release detailed information on
> crimes committed by concealed handgun permit holders, the
> incidents listed above are from news reports. The actual
> number of lethal non-self defense incidents involving private
> citizens legally allowed to carry concealed handguns is most
> likely far, far higher.
>
> And yet, according to concealed carry advocate Dave Workman,
> concealed handgun permit holder and mass shooter Ian Stawicki
> had "his own life to live."
>
> What about his victims and their families?
>
> -----------------------------------
>
> Seeya round town, Moscow.
>
> Tom Hansen
> Moscow, Idaho
>
> "We're a town of about 23,000 with 10,000 college students.
> The college students are not very active in local elections
> (thank goodness!)."
>
> - Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)
>
> On Aug 12, 2012, at 12:03 PM, Paul Rumelhart
> <godshatter at yahoo.com <mailto:godshatter at yahoo.com>> wrote:
>
>
> Well, pony up your evidence. Since we seem to be so
> focused on high visibility mass shootings, how many of
> those turned out worse because of someone with a CWP
> permit? How many victims in such cases have been shot by
> someone with a CWP returning fire?
>
> I'm not exactly a gun nut, by the way, I'd never owned a
> gun before a couple of years ago when I inherited one.
> I've shot a few, mostly when I was younger. I would just
> like to talk about this as if I wasn't promoting a side,
> but no one here has allowed that. Ever since my first
> post where I wondered what would have happened in Aurora
> if someone had a concealed firearm on their person I've
> ran headlong into a wall of (paraphrasing) "a guy with a
> concealed handgun could in no way, ever, actually be
> helpful in such a situation".
>
> Just to test my understanding, can you conceive of a
> situation involving a shooter on a killing spree where a
> responsible person with a concealed weapon might actually
> have helped things?
>
> Paul
>
> On 08/12/2012 09:44 AM, Joe Campbell wrote:
>
> I'm not denying anyone anything. It is annoying that
> no matter how
>
> carefully I state my points you keep characterizing
> them as something
>
> else -- in this case as an example of "rabid anti-gun
> rhetoric." I'm
>
> not anti-gun or anti-2nd amendment. In fact, I've
> taken my son
>
> shooting on several occasions in the past few months,
> with a
>
> knowledgeable friend who has been offering gun safety
> lessons as well.
>
> I don't own a gun for the reasons I've stated: I am
> far more likely to
>
> hurt myself or others with it than to help anyone. And
> so are you and
>
> so is nearly everyone. That's been my only point.
> Start carrying a gun
>
> around to "protect" yourself and you are FAR more
> likely to do harm
>
> than good. Yours is a fear-driven attitude with
> absolutely no evidence
>
> to support it. Statistics prove this, as well as the
> fact that you
>
> can't find one single example of a person saving the
> day in a
>
> (potential) spree-killing. Not one. Yet you continue
> to hold on to the
>
> view that it is not a myth. Mine is a very simple,
> reasonable,
>
> rational point backed by countless evidence. For you
> to turn it into
>
> some type of radical view is egregious but I'll have
> to get used to it
>
> since you do this all the time.
>
>
> On Aug 12, 2012, at 9:14 AM, Paul Rumelhart
> <godshatter at yahoo.com <mailto:godshatter at yahoo.com>>
> wrote:
>
>
> I guess there's no point in looking for other
> examples. Pre-planned, well-executed mass-murders
> just aren't common enough to give you those
> statistics and the percentage of CWP holder is
> (I'm guessing) relatively small, and most of these
> killing sprees happen in gun-free zones where
> law-abiding permit holders wouldn't be armed
> anyway. This NY Times article claims that the
> Aurora theater banned firearms (even to permit
> holders), which places it in the category of
> "gun-free zones" too.
>
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/21/us/colorado-gun-laws-remain-lax-despite-changes-after-columbine.html?_r=1
>
>
> If someone had you pinned down in a dark theater
> and you feared for your life wouldn't you want
> some way to defend yourself? I don't get this
> rabid anti-gun rhetoric. I notice the ban
> firearms policy didn't stop James Holmes from
> going on his killing spree. Metal detectors
> wouldn't have helped, either, because he left and
> came back through the exit doors which wouldn't
> have had them anyway. Even a complete firearms
> ban country-wide wouldn't have helped because I
> doubt he would have had qualms about purchasing
> guns on the black market. It might have taken him
> longer to prepare, is all.
>
>
> Short of a 1984-esque society, I don't know how
> you could stop this kind of thing. Even if they
> were successful, this guy could have done what he
> did with a satchel full of Molotov cocktails. So
> why not even the odds and allow people the option
> of personal defense?
>
>
> Paul
>
>
> On 08/12/2012 07:10 AM, Joe Campbell wrote:
>
> But this is a case in which someone did not
> use a gun to defend
>
> himself against the attacker. According to the
> Pastor, "I was up there
>
> preaching, and I stepped off of there into a
> chair and on the rail
>
> that went around, and I dove right off and
> grabbed the gun." The
>
> Pastor had concealed weapons training but
> didn't use a gun to prevent
>
> further harm.
>
>
> Again, I have nothing against training,
> nothing against guns frankly
>
> (though I think it is too easy to get guns in
> our country). My main
>
> point is that guns usually do more harm than
> good. It is rare that
>
> having a gun will actually help you and the
> evidence suggests that if
>
> you own a gun you are far more likely to be
> harmed by it -- either by
>
> accident or by an assailant taking it from you
> -- than you are of
>
> protecting yourself in an Aurora type situation.
>
>
>
> On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 11:45 PM, Paul
> Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com
> <mailto:godshatter at yahoo.com>> wrote:
>
> Here's one that happened in Boiling
> Springs, SC. Some links to news stories
>
> about it:
>
>
> http://www.wyff4.com/Deputies-Armed-Man-Kicks-In-Church-Door-During-Service/-/9324882/10075734/-/item/1/-/jjxqgj/-/index.html
>
> http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2012/03/25/Man-with-shotgun-arrested-at-SC-church/UPI-35931332729850/
>
> http://charlotte.cbslocal.com/2012/03/26/sheriff-concealed-weapon-saves-church-from-man-armed-with-shotgun/
>
>
> tl;dr version: A man with a CWP, armed,
> sees a man take a shotgun out of
>
> the trunk of his car during church
> services. He warns the congregation, and
>
> locks the doors. The man kicks in a side
> door and is disarmed and wrestled
>
> to the ground by parishioners and held at
> gunpoint by the guy with the
>
> concealed weapons permit until authorities
> arrive. The shotgun the man had
>
> brought was loaded, and he claims he was
> going to kidnap the pastor.
>
>
> I don't know if this would have turned
> into a bloodbath if that guy hadn't
>
> acted quickly, I doubt anyone does.
> That's the trouble with this sort of
>
> request as Gary alluded to. We don't know
> that this would have been a
>
> tragedy without his help, but it sure
> might have been one.
>
>
> Paul
>
>
>
> On 08/11/2012 09:52 PM, Joe Campbell wrote:
>
>
> Well I can't. But you said it was a
> robbery, not a Columbine or Aurora type
>
> situation. Certainly you can't be sure he
> didn't prevent deaths; can't be
>
> sure their guns were loaded either. You
> just don't know. Paul was talking
>
> about an Aurora type situation, where the
> purpose is spree killing. Any
>
> examples of someone preventing that from
> happening with a handgun? Haven't
>
> heard or seen of one yet.
>
>
>
>
> On Aug 11, 2012, at 8:28 PM, "Gary
> Crabtree" <jampot at roadrunner.com
> <mailto:jampot at roadrunner.com>> wrote:
>
>
> So, logically speaking, how can you know
> what was prevented? How can you
>
> know that one of the bandits wouldn't have
> started shooting and not quit
>
> till the incident had assumed tragic
> proportions? Were did you acquire this
>
> awesome ability to determine what might
> and might not have been?
>
>
> g
>
>
> From: Joe Campbell
>
> Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 3:46 PM
>
> To: Gary Crabtree
>
> Cc: Paul Rumelhart ;
> <vision2020 at moscow.com
> <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com>>
>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] [more] Look See
> What Tri-State is Promoting . . .
>
>
> Well whether someone used a gun and saved
> the day in a case like Aurora is
>
> either true or false. If true, when and where?
>
>
> The case you have is different. Robbers
> who shot NO ONE and were
>
> subsequently shot by an old man. Not a
> case of preventing violence by any
>
> means.
>
>
> I guess your next suggestion is to get rid
> of police -- too much big
>
> government -- and it's everyone for himself.
>
>
> On Aug 11, 2012, at 2:34 PM, "Gary
> Crabtree" <jampot at roadrunner.com
> <mailto:jampot at roadrunner.com>> wrote:
>
>
> CWP holders will be reluctant to pipe up
> in as much as part of concealed is
>
> keeping your yap shut and avoiding telling
> all of Gods creation that you're
>
> healed. Your opinion is looked on with
> favor by some to be sure.
>
>
> A recent example of an armed citizen
> exercising his rights to good effect:
>
>
> http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/71-Year-Old-Man-Shoots-Would-Be-Robbers-at-Ocala-Internet-Cafe-Authorities-162941656.html
>
>
> To say that a guy with a hand gun has
> never prevented a massacre is
>
> illogical in as much as who can say what
> might have happened had a different
>
> path been followed? In one scenario two
> goblins are wounded and taken to
>
> jail. In another, a dozen innocents
> minding their own business in a internet
>
> café are senselessly murdered...film at 11:00
>
>
> g
>
>
> From: Paul Rumelhart
>
> Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 9:57 AM
>
> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com>
>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] [more] Look See
> What Tri-State is Promoting . . .
>
>
>
> Yes, you'd have to be damn sure about your
> line of fire. Firing in the
>
> middle of a frenzied crowd running
> panicked for the exits would surely be
>
> asking for trouble. However, it's my
> understanding that for a while during
>
> the shooting the shooter had complete
> control of the situation. Anyone
>
> trying to leave was shot. Many people
> were playing dead in the hopes they
>
> would be passed over. Firing on the
> shooter, even if he's in body armor,
>
> might distract him enough that some people
> might have made it to the exits.
>
> Body armor doesn't make you invincible,
> depending on the armor and the
>
> caliber of the weapon used you might still
> have made an impact, since he'd
>
> still be hit by the blunt force of the
> bullet. In this situation, though,
>
> you would probably also have been shot
> dead shortly after because he was so
>
> well prepared (vest, leggings, throat
> protector, groin protector, and a
>
> helmet with a visor). Who knows? Telling
> a loved one "when I start
>
> shooting, RUN for the exit and don't stop"
> might have worked.
>
>
> Most other shootings like this we've heard
> about haven't involved such a
>
> heavily armored assailant. In fact, quite
> a few of them have taken place in
>
> areas where gun use is often restricted,
> such as in schools or on university
>
> campuses. Harris and Kliebold wore
> T-shirts and cargo pants at Columbine.
>
> A student who had happened to have
> smuggled a gun into the school might have
>
> been able to have had a real impact on
> that event.
>
>
> An interesting thing to think about, in my
> opinion. Apparently, that
>
> opinion is not shared on this list.
>
>
> Paul
>
>
>
> On 08/11/2012 08:13 AM, Art Deco wrote:
>
>
> It's hard to think of something more
> foolish than someone or ones with a
>
> hand gun in a disorganized, panicky crowd
> trying to shoot a person with a
>
> automatic weapon shielded by body armor.
> How many more victims would be
>
> added to the final body count?
>
>
> Didn't something like this happen in the
> Moscow Massacre?
>
>
> w.
>
>
> On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 7:02 AM, Donovan
> Arnold
>
> <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
> <mailto:donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>> wrote:
>
> Tom,
>
>
> While your wife if shopping Tri-State,
> you should be to. I mean come on,
>
> support your community why don't you. :)
>
>
> Donovan J. Arnold
>
>
> From: Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com
> <mailto:thansen at moscow.com>>
>
> To: Sunil Ramalingam
> <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com
> <mailto:sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>>
>
> Cc: "<vision2020 at moscow.com
> <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com>>"
> <vision2020 at moscow.com
> <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com>>
>
> Sent: Friday, August 10, 2012 6:47 PM
>
>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] [more] Look
> See What Tri-State is Promoting . .
>
> .
>
>
> You may very well be right, Sunil.
>
>
> It's just a habit I have acquired
> while in the service. Trust those
>
> around you, but keep your powder dry.
>
>
> I saw the poster at Tri-State. And,
> as I've said before, this is the
>
> first time I have seen such an
> advertisement in Moscow. I checked a few
>
> things out, such as its website, phone
> number, etc. etc. etc. (Hey, I needed
>
> something to pass the time while my
> wife was shopping at Tri-State).
>
>
> The more I dug, the more red flags I
> found. The more red flags I found,
>
> the more I dug. I have so many info
> sources, concerning the NFT Academy,
>
> bookmarked for reference I am thinking
> of discarding half of 'em.
>
>
> Seeya round town, Moscow.
>
>
> Tom Hansen
>
> Moscow, Idaho
>
>
> "We're a town of about 23,000 with
> 10,000 college students. The college
>
> students are not very active in local
> elections (thank goodness!)."
>
>
> - Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)
>
>
>
> On Aug 10, 2012, at 6:19 PM, Sunil
> Ramalingam
>
> <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com
> <mailto:sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>>
> wrote:
>
>
> I've taken such a class and in the
> past had a concealed weapon permit; who
>
> knows, I may again. I don't think this
> class is a big deal.
>
>
> Sunil
>
>
> From: thansen at moscow.com
> <mailto:thansen at moscow.com>
>
> Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2012 17:41:58 -0700
>
> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com>
>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] [more] Look
> See What Tri-State is Promoting . .
>
> .
>
>
> The primary reason this caught my eye
> . . .
>
>
> I have lived here in Moscow for just
> over twenty years. The is the FIRST
>
> time I have seen concealed-weapon
> classes openly advertised in town. Couple
>
> that up with the increasing paranoia,
> as a result of the recent instances in
>
> Aurora (Colorado) and Milwaukee
> (Wisconsin), and I feel I have a right
> to be
>
> curious.
>
>
> BTW, the NFT Academy website has only
> been in existence since April 2012
>
> and was not publicly released until
> June 12, 2012 (TWO MONTHS AGO).
>
>
>
> http://fiddlerstudios.com/created-by-fs/announcing-the-national-firearms-training-academy-website/
>
>
> I have more info to share, concerning
> the NFT Academy and its website, but
>
> let's see where this thread leads.
>
>
> Seeya round town, Moscow.
>
>
> Tom Hansen
>
> Moscow, Idaho
>
>
> "We're a town of about 23,000 with
> 10,000 college students. The college
>
> students are not very active in local
> elections (thank goodness!)."
>
>
> - Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)
>
>
>
> On Aug 10, 2012, at 3:09 PM, Sunil
> Ramalingam
>
> <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com
> <mailto:sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>>
> wrote:
>
>
> Something legal? The nerve! Next
> they'll be selling guns!
>
>
> Sunil
>
>
> From: thansen at moscow.com
> <mailto:thansen at moscow.com>
>
> Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2012 14:24:56 -0700
>
> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com>
>
> Subject: [Vision2020] Look See What
> Tri-State is Promoting . . .
>
>
>
>
> Seeya round town, Moscow.
>
>
> Tom Hansen
>
> Moscow, Idaho
>
>
> "We're a town of about 23,000 with
> 10,000 college students. The college
>
> students are not very active in local
> elections (thank goodness!)."
>
>
>
> - Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)
>
>
>
>
> =======================================================
> List services made
>
> available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse
>
> since 1994. http://www.fsr.net/
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>
> =======================================================
>
>
> =======================================================
>
> List services made available by First
> Step Internet,
>
> serving the communities of the Palouse
> since 1994.
>
> http://www.fsr.net/
>
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>
> =======================================================
>
>
>
> =======================================================
> List services made
>
> available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse
>
> since 1994. http://www.fsr.net/
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>
> =======================================================
>
>
> =======================================================
>
> List services made available by First
> Step I
>
> =======================================================
>
> List services made available by First Step
> Internet,
>
> serving the communities of the Palouse
> since 1994.
>
> http://www.fsr.net
>
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>
> =======================================================
>
>
>
>
> =======================================================
> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> http://www.fsr.net
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> =======================================================
>
>
>
> ======================================================= List services
> made available by First Step Internet, serving the communities of the
> Palouse since 1994. http://www.fsr.net mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> =======================================================
>
>
> =======================================================
> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> http://www.fsr.net
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> =======================================================
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