[Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to Financial Crisis
Tom Hansen
thansen at moscow.com
Tue Apr 28 12:51:18 PDT 2009
Pay-cuts or lay-offs?
In my opinion, some money is better than no money.
It all comes down to how concerned one is about his/her neighbor.
Tom Hansen
Moscow, Idaho
> As a staff member at UI, I would rather do furloughs than get a 3% cut, and I
> would rather do either than have more people be laid off.
>
> I think furloughs are better than the cuts, because all of the talk I've heard
> about them are assuming a level below which the employee will not have to go
> on furlough. The cuts seem to be straight across the board, at least for
> staff. I'm lucky enough that I can take the cuts without losing too much in
> my finances, but I know a lot of people that can't.
>
> Paul
>
> --- On Tue, 4/28/09, Saundra Lund <sslund_2007 at verizon.net> wrote:
>
> From: Saundra Lund <sslund_2007 at verizon.net>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to Financial Crisis
> To: "'Joe Campbell'" <philosopher.joe at gmail.com>, "'Dickow'"
> <dickow at turbonet.com>
> Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com
> Date: Tuesday, April 28, 2009, 9:54 AM
>
> I thought it was an excellent post as well . . . I had the privilege of
> meeting Mr. Dickow last night for the first time & told him so in person.
>
> I also have a question: will the new UI president also be taking a pay cut?
> If not, then I see why anyone should have to take one.
>
> I have another question as well: a couple of friends I have who are staff
> members at UI are far more in favor of furloughs than pay cuts to keep
> anyone from being fired. One friend explained it as a pay cut is going to
> be a major hardship on many whether it comes from an actual pay cut or
> furlough, but at least with mandatory furloughs, you get something in
> return: some free time and the opportunity to look for a little part-time
> gig to make up for the reduced pay from working fewer hours. She said
> that's what she did the last time to keep her head above water. I'm
> wondering what others think about furloughs instead of pay cuts?
>
> And, I have a comment as well. I think it truly admirable that so many are
> willing to take pay cuts to save the jobs of others in the university
> community! However, I'd be happier if I saw that same caring spirit from
> those at the top by them being willing to sacrifice for those at the bottom
> who can ill-afford *any* pay cut. There's a *huge* difference, IMHO,
> between taking a pay cut that may cause you to have to skip one of several
> vacations this year or not be able to buy a new car and not being able to go
> to the doctor what with that $2300 deductible on the only coverage plan you
> could afford in the first place or not being able to buy your kids new shoes
> or being able to afford to pay your child support.
>
> The people I know at the lower end of the pay scales have a different
> attitude about these pay cuts: they'd love to be in a position to be able
> to comfortably advocate for pay cuts to save jobs. That doesn't mean that
> they don't prefer taking pay cuts to losing their own jobs, but it's a lot
> harder for them to swallow taking cuts that will threaten their families to
> save the jobs of others. Some are very scared about how they'll manage to
> live with a pay cut. And, I can't say as I blame them.
>
>
> JMHO,
> Saundra Lund
> Moscow, ID
>
> The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to do
> nothing.
> ~ Edmund Burke
>
> ***** Original material contained herein is Copyright 2009 through life plus
> 70 years, Saundra Lund. Do not copy, forward, excerpt, or reproduce outside
> the Vision 2020 forum without the express written permission of the
> author.*****
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com]
> On Behalf Of Joe Campbell
> Sent: Tuesday, April 28, 2009 5:50 AM
> To: Dickow
> Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to Financial Crisis
>
> This is a great post. I wonder why no one has responded.
>
> Joe Campbell
>
> On Apr 27, 2009, at 12:23 PM, Dickow <dickow at turbonet.com> wrote:
>
>> The problem in my book concerning a 3% cut to state employees is
>> that it is, in effect, a direct tax on a special segment of the
>> state's population. The state would be making up its shortfalls at
>> the expense of state employees. I think that the state shouldn't be
>> thought of as an entity like a company, which might indeed have to
>> trim their employees in some form or other. But in in the case of
>> the state, the employees would be making a sacrifice that directly
>> benefits other people in the state, not the owners of a somel
>> corporation. A more equitable solution to the state's budgetary woes
>> would be to impose a tax of some kind on everyone in the state.
>> Then, everyone might have to kick back 1/2 percent or something, and
>> all would be well. But alas, raising taxes is political NO NO!
>> And... by the way, whatever happened to the state's Emergency Fund.
>> did they spend that already?
>>
>> Bob Dickow, troublemaker
>>
>> -----Original message-----
>> From: Joe Campbell philosopher.joe at gmail.com
>> Date: Mon, 27 Apr 2009 09:37:18 -0700
>> To: lfalen lfalen at turbonet.com
>> Subject: [Spam] Re: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>> Financial Crisis
>>
>>> I'm sorry to hear about your wife's situation, Roger. Staff is
>>> getting
>>> the worst of it at WSU, too.
>>>
>>> But I still think Nick has a point. Here is one way to put it. Would
>>> you or anyone else on this list be willing to "cut" your pay by
>>> giving
>>> 3% more to the state of ID to help prevent folks at UI from being
>>> fired? If you and others say "yes," then I'm on board, as well!
>>>
>>> Joe Campbell
>>>
>>> On Apr 27, 2009, at 10:03 AM, lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Joe
>>>> I do no want you or any one else to lose their job. I think that pay
>>>> cuts are preferable to layoffs.It is inevitably that some programs
>>>> will be cut. there are no students or very few for a class it will
>>>> be cut. My wife is staff in the PSES department at UI. She runs the
>>>> Soils Pedology Lab. She will receive an award for 40 years of
>>>> service today. She puts in 10 to 12 hours a day and does not get
>>>> comp. time. She had cancer in 2003. She had surgery, chemo,
>>>> radiation and the whole ball of wax. She is still suffering from
>>>> the after affects. She takes a lot of Ibuprofen and diuretics to
>>>> keep on going. She is not yet eligible for full Social Security.
>>>> <snip>....
>>
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