[Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to Financial Crisis
Joe Campbell
philosopher.joe at gmail.com
Fri Apr 24 06:05:08 PDT 2009
Look, I have tenure and if my department gets cut, I can lose my job.
That doesn't sound like I'm immune from pay cuts since they can cut
the whole thing. That's how it is at WSU.
As far as I know many if not all faculty are taking paycuts at UI, so
they can't be immune either.
Joe Campbell
On Apr 23, 2009, at 7:59 PM, Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com>
wrote:
> Presumably a pay cut and the added bonus of keeping your job while
> others might be losing theirs. If I'm understanding Roger, his beef
> is with tenured professors being immune from pay cuts - not with
> their being immune from being laid off.
>
> Paul
>
> Joe Campbell wrote:
>> Maybe I should have expressed my question more clearly, What is
>> tenure without the salary? What do you get with that?
>>
>> Joe Campbell
>>
>> On Apr 23, 2009, at 8:43 AM, lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> All I am saying is that pay cuts should affect everyone, starting
>>> with administrators. It makes no sence to cut the pay of those on
>>> the lowest end of the pay scale while excluding those that make
>>> more. If the rules for tenure do not allow for this, then the
>>> rules need to be changed.
>>> Roger
>>> -----Original message-----
>>> From: nickgier at roadrunner.com
>>> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2009 14:22:01 -0700
>>> To: vision2020 at moscow.com, lfalen lfalen at turbonet.com, "Gier,
>>> Nicholas" NGIER at uidaho.edu
>>> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>>> Financial Crisis
>>>
>>>
>>>> Hi Roger,
>>>>
>>>> If tenure protects base salary, as two legal cases indicate that
>>>> it does, then a contract that invalidated that aspect of tenure
>>>> would be illegal and no faculty member should agree to it.
>>>>
>>>> Nick
>>>> ---- lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> You are reading in things that arn't there. I said only that
>>>>> future tenure contract should not lock in salaries in the event
>>>>> that every one else takes a pay cut. In this narrow regard, no
>>>>> one should be immuned.
>>>>> Roger
>>>>> -----Original message-----
>>>>> From: "Gier, Nicholas" NGIER at uidaho.edu
>>>>> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2009 14:01:58 -0700
>>>>> To: "lfalen" lfalen at turbonet.com, nickgier at roadrunner.com, vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>>>>> Financial Crisis
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Roger,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Here are your exact words:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "If this is prohibited by tenured rules, these should be
>>>>>> changed going forward. Contracts should be honored as the
>>>>>> early retires contracts should be honored. The thing is do not
>>>>>> make these kinds of contracts in the future."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Perhaps you did not mean to say it, but you wrote this and it
>>>>>> clearly implies that future contracts for faculty would not
>>>>>> include tenure.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Nick
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: lfalen [mailto:lfalen at turbonet.com]
>>>>>> Sent: Wed 4/22/2009 1:53 PM
>>>>>> To: Gier, Nicholas; nickgier at roadrunner.com;
>>>>>> vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>>>>>> Financial Crisis
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I did not say anything about eliminating tenure, only that
>>>>>> they should be subject to same rules as staff when it comes to
>>>>>> pay cuts.
>>>>>> Roger
>>>>>> -----Original message-----
>>>>>> From: "Gier, Nicholas" NGIER at uidaho.edu
>>>>>> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2009 10:42:01 -0700
>>>>>> To: "lfalen" lfalen at turbonet.com, nickgier at roadrunner.com, vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>>>>>> Financial Crisis
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Roger,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If you are suggesting that Idaho eliminate tenure, then
>>>>>>> prospective faculty members will not apply for jobs on
>>>>>>> Idaho's campuses. That of course would be disastrous for
>>>>>>> Idaho higher education.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tenure is necessary for academic freedom and that means, after
>>>>>>> a rigorous probationary period of 5-7 years, tenured
>>>>>>> professors have career-long protection from political
>>>>>>> interference in their teaching, research, and service.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nick
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com on behalf of lfalen
>>>>>>> Sent: Wed 4/22/2009 10:39 AM
>>>>>>> To: nickgier at roadrunner.com; vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>>>>>>> Financial Crisis
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nick
>>>>>>> I agree with you on administrative position and athletics,
>>>>>>> though not necessarily on tenure. If cuts do get down to
>>>>>>> staff positions, it should also include tenured faculty. If
>>>>>>> this is prohibited by tenured rules, these should be changed
>>>>>>> going forward. Contracts should be honored as the early
>>>>>>> retires contracts should be honored. The thing is do not make
>>>>>>> these kinds of contracts in the future.
>>>>>>> Roger
>>>>>>> -----Original message-----
>>>>>>> From: nickgier at roadrunner.com
>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 14:54:37 -0700
>>>>>>> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>> Subject: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>>>>>>> Financial Crisis
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> IFT HIGHER EDUCATION COUNCIL RESPONDS TO FINANCIAL CRISIS
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On April 15, 2009 the Higher Education Council of the Idaho
>>>>>>>> Federation of Teachers, AFT/AFL-CIO met in a phone
>>>>>>>> conference to discuss the financial crisis.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Those present were Valia Tatarova, Idaho State University
>>>>>>>> (physics); Lynn Lubamersky, Boise State University
>>>>>>>> (history); Chris Riggs, Lewis-Clark State College (history);
>>>>>>>> Lynne Haagensen, University of Idaho (art); Joyce Lider,
>>>>>>>> North Idaho College (English); Susan Andrews, IFT Vice-
>>>>>>>> President for Higher Education; and Nick Gier, IFT President.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I. Salary Reduction Proposal. According to a legal opinion
>>>>>>>> from the AFT national office, academic tenure protects base
>>>>>>>> salary. Tenure is a property right and at least two court
>>>>>>>> cases have recognized that base salary is part of that
>>>>>>>> property. The IFT Higher Education Council voted to oppose
>>>>>>>> any salary reductions for tenured faculty. We join the BSU
>>>>>>>> Faculty Senate President in vowing to file a case action
>>>>>>>> suit if tenured faculty are forced to take a pay cut. In a
>>>>>>>> related decision the IFT Higher Education Council voted that
>>>>>>>> classified staff, lecturers, and non-tenured faculty be
>>>>>>>> exempt from salary reductions and proposed that salary
>>>>>>>> savings be taken from those making more than $100,000.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> II. Teaching positions should have priority over
>>>>>>>> administrative positions. Nation-wide administrative
>>>>>>>> positions have generally grown at a greater rate than
>>>>>>>> teaching positions. The example of BSU is especially
>>>>>>>> egregious: from 2005-2007 BSU had over 100 more
>>>>>>>> administrators than its peers but 191 fewer faculty members
>>>>>>>> instructing students than peer institutions. Administrative
>>>>>>>> salaries have also outpaced faculty pay. Since 1982 the
>>>>>>>> salaries of 11 top UI administrative positions have
>>>>>>>> increased 260 percent while full professor salaries
>>>>>>>> increased 198 percent. (CPI for the period was 215.) (For
>>>>>>>> more see <www.home.roadrunner.com/~nickgier/salaries.htm
>>>>>>>>> .) The IFT Higher Education Council voted to recommend that
>>>>>>>> administrative positions be cut before teaching positions.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> III. Appropriated funds are for academics not athletics.
>>>>>>>> Since 1987 state subsidies for athletics at the UI has grown
>>>>>>>> 338 percent while appropriations for Idaho higher education
>>>>>>>> has grown 159 percent. Currently the state subsidies for UI
>>>>>>>> and ISU athletics are over $3 million. Since 1999 private
>>>>>>>> contributions to UI athletics rose 246 percent, indicating
>>>>>>>> the potential for it to wean itself, as any non-academic
>>>>>>>> program should, from its state subsidy. (For more see <www.home.roadrunner.com/~nickgier/athletics.htm
>>>>>>>>> .) The IFT Higher Education Council voted to request that
>>>>>>>> state monies for athletics on all Idaho campuses be phased
>>>>>>>> out over 4-6 years.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> IV. Program reduction procedures must be revised. In 2002
>>>>>>>> the Idaho State Board of Education (SBOE) instituted new
>>>>>>>> procedures for program reduction. At that time the IFT
>>>>>>>> objected to a lack of protection for tenured faculty and
>>>>>>>> requested that the procedures be revised. As no revisions
>>>>>>>> have been made, IFT president asked in December 2008 for a
>>>>>>>> legal opinion from the national office. The response was
>>>>>>>> that these procedures undermine tenure and do not comply
>>>>>>>> with Idaho law. (For more see <www.home.roadrunner.com/~nickgier/ProgramReduction.htm
>>>>>>>> >.) The IFT Higher Education Council voted to urge the SBOE
>>>>>>>> to revise these procedures such that tenured faculty have
>>>>>>>> the same protection as under the procedures for financial
>>>>>>>> exigency.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>>>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>>>>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>>>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>> =======================================================
>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> =======================================================
>>>
>>
>> =======================================================
>> List services made available by First Step Internet, serving the
>> communities of the Palouse since 1994. http://www.fsr.net
>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>> =======================================================
>>
>>
>
>
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