[Vision2020] Archies on the Square

[Bruce and Jean Livingston]

The demonstrations against this business do not have my support and I wish they would stop.  This one isolated and unfortunate incident appears to arise out of a misunderstanding in which blame can be lain as easily on the caregiver as on the business owner. 

An unfortunate incident occurred that was the result of a misunderstanding.  It is plain to me that the incident can be a "teachable moment" from which all can learn, and that bleeding a restaurant business to death by demonstration or boycott in a community that could use more, non-fast food, dining options is not the best solution. 

The Moscow Hotel is a downtown anchor whose businesses have been battling parking issues, even though the Hotel was one of the original contributors to the Jackson Street parking lot for downtown merchants.  It is not in Moscow or our downtown's interest to attack or boycott locally owned, tax-paying businesses in the downtown core that we are trying to preserve and protect without having much more to go on than this one isolated and unfortunate incident.  

Bruce Livingston
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: laurie curry 
  To: Art Deco ; Vision 2020 
  Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2007 5:00 PM
  Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Archies on the Square [DN Article: Read carefullyand completely]


  Just in case any of you missed my letter earlier, I am sorry to say that perception is just as much in my letter as the one below it. I guess you as educated people will make the decision on your own what you will take and use as credible information.  I am sorry that anyone would would ever interpret anything that was done at Archies as a deliberate attempt to discriminate against people with disabilities and I hope that your recognition of this will pursuade you to keep your signs and protests to events that are factual and not for used as a witch hunt because a few individuals have twisted their interpretations to meet their definitions!

  Copy of earlier posting.....Wow, I am shocked and amazed that I was able to read such a large article in the Moscow Daily News about this young man that had and altercation at Archies on The Square.
  I know Jim Johnson and his wife Archie, they are friends of my family and most importantly came to visit my husband and myself to get the scoop on Idaho before they moved here.  I told them how wonderful the people were here in Idaho and how much they would love it.  I told them to pack up and leave and open a place here because they would do wonderful and people would love them.  So imagine my surprise when I read this article.  Oh did I mention that my brother in law (Billy) is mentally handicapped?  Yep he sure is, you cant tell until you start to have a conversation with him, but he is functioning at the level of a 6 or 7 year old.  Did I also mention that he has known Archie and Jim along time?  Yep he does, in fact his brother took Archie to the her prom and the two of them, even after marriage have remained good friends, and their spouses are good friends, and well we all live in Idaho now.  I just wanted to say that Jim has always been so good to my Billy, even when Billy has yelled across the room to customers in the restaurant to say hello and ask if they are having a good morning or evening or whatever the case may be.  Jim is in no way the villain that the paper and Mr. Hopper have made him sound like.

  When we take Billy out,  people don't know he is disabled, the ladies in the park didn't know when this 7' man started to play with their children on the swings and slides that he was harmless.  We saw them as they spoke to each other with horrified looks on their faces, and as one mom was getting ready to go take her child from the playground we walked over and told her that Billy may be tall and look like an adult but truly he was just a child in that park and having a great time.  We let them know that Billy wasn't dangerous (as some people with disabilities can be, depending on their level of disability) and he would just have a great time with the kids, if they allowed him too.  The next week they invited Billy to the High School Dance to be a Chaperon/guest!  Billy rocked the place and dances as the kids chanted his name, he was so very happy and why? Because of something it took 5 seconds to do!
  Does anyone know what we did right in that picture?  Yep you got it, we as responsible adults/ caregivers spoke to the people who could easily have misunderstood the situation and we gave them the valuable information they needed to make and informed decision about the safety of their children!  This could have easily gone wrong had we ignored the signs or simply looked away because we expected people to automatically know Billy is handicapped.  We don't like to use terms like handicapped, disabled or even retarded since birth, as Billy is, but Billy knows that we have to tell people, that not all people can see this and for his safety we have the responsibility to let people know right away, and Billy also knows the principals of respect and peoples space.  He may not always show restraint but we surely do not ever let him walk across a public place and walk into the middle of a conversation with strangers, unless we follow quickly behind to explain and also to guide Billy in the appropriate behavior.
  Jim Johnson knows Billy, he treats Billy with care and respect and he includes him in our conversations when we visit he and his wife.  Jim Johnson and his wife came here to meet the good people of Idaho and some irresponsible handler thought that his way of being indignant to a situation he could have easily avoided is to protest and ruin the lively hood of a family.  Archie's on the Square is their lively hood they came here with the dream of being a family place where they could see and be part of this great State, and anyone who would stoop to such a level of revenge for an honest misunderstanding well I have to say, I would never let them be in the same room with Billy let alone be the person who guides him or teaches him as Billy would not be the loving kind person he is, he would be disrespectful and ignorant of the world around him and well I am glad that Mr Hopper isn't a caregiver for us!
  Respectfully Mrs. Laurie Curry



  Art Deco <deco at moscow.com> wrote: 
    It was an unfortunate incident and probably could have been better handled by both parties, and handled in a way that brought out the best for all concerned, especially the disabled individual.  But at least there seems to be some agreement on some of the "facts."

    Chasuk wrote:

    "Hopper's allegations are supported only by his word. ... I do know that Hopper is the type of man who has no qualms destroying a person's life over an unprovable claim."

     
    However, if we are to believe Omie Drawhorn of the Daily News, part of Hopper's claim seems not to be disputed, for example:

    "Hopper said he then told Johnson that Skelton wasn't drunk, but disabled.
    "He [Johnson] said 'How should I know? He should wear a goddamn sign around his neck,' " Hopper said.
    When Hopper threatened to write a letter to the editor about the incident, Johnson told Hopper he could write two for all he cared.
    "He had plenty of time to say he misunderstood, but he just became enraged again," Hopper said.
    Johnson said he did say those things, but he was provoked."

    I don't know either Johnson or Hopper.  I have eaten twice at Archies.

    I am concerned about two things however, the first of major concern, the second, not so much:

    1.    The quote, apparently accurate and made while provoked, Johnson made about disabled persons: "How should I know?  He should wear a goddamn sign around his neck," ... is disturbing. 

    Aside from being grossly insensitive and demonstrating an attitude about disabled persons not particularly admirable, it is not the kind of thing an astute businessperson who has just "come to Moscow and invested $650,000 in this town" should say in public no matter what his private feelings.

    2.    The claim made by  Chasuk as a response to the Daily News article that "Hopper's allegations are supported only by his word."  and  "Hopper is the type of man who has no qualms destroying a person's life over an unprovable claim." is not supported by the article to unless we assume Drawhorn is mistaken or lying.  


    I do not think that Johnson and Archies have been irretrievably damaged here.  What will determine how much damage, if any, occurs is how Johnson responds now that there has been time to cool down and evaluate.  I see that Tom Hansen has posted what appears to be a oral interview with Johnson.  I cannot listen to it as my computer sound is not working correctly so I do not know what Johnson has said so far.  It is not my place to advise Johnson on how to execute damage control, but at least some of it should be obvious.


    This incident presents what an experienced teacher would call a teachable moment.  I tried to make my contribution of some things that might be learned in my response yesterday.  Some people have understood; others obviously not.

    The continuation of this discussion has not yet reduced its value as a teachable moment.  I hope that others much more qualified than I on the non-epistemological aspects of this issue will continue to help us all to learn to be better able to more sensitively and effectively deal with situations which Hopper and Johnson faced, and to demonstrate compassion to those innocently much less abled than most of us.


    Wayne A. Fox
    1009 Karen Lane
    PO Box 9421
    Moscow, ID  83843

    (208) 882-7975
    waf at moscow.com


    ----- Original Message ----- 
    http://mailman.fsr.com/pipermail/vision2020/2007-March/042871.html
    From: "Chasuk" <chasuk at gmail.com>
    To: "Art Deco" <deco at moscow.com>
    Cc: "Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
    Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2007 12:36 PM
    Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Archies on the Square [DN Article: Read carefully and completely]


    > The accusation of discrimination against the disabled is as corrosive
    > to a person's reputation as an accusation of rape.  No proof is
    > necessary; the damage is instant and irreversible.
    > 
    > I don't know Tom Hopper, and I don't know Jim Johnson, but that this
    > private misunderstanding has turned into a public crucifixion makes me
    > nauseous. Hopper's allegations are supported only by his word.  I have
    > no reason to believe Johnson's word over Hopper's (or vice versa), but
    > I do know that Hopper is the type of man who has no qualms destroying
    > a person's life over an unprovable claim.
    >

    Residents protest restaurant owner's treatment of man; Another protest planned outside Archie's on the Square
    By Omie Drawhorn, Daily News staff writer
    Tuesday, March 27, 2007 - Page Updated at 12:06:00 PM
    A group of Moscow residents protested in Friendship Square on Sunday in response to an alleged incident of discrimination against a disabled man. Protestors plan to return this Sunday as well.
    The incident started when Moscow residents Tom Hopper and Dan Skelton, 34, visited Archie's on the Square for breakfast Sunday.
    Skelton, who is nonverbal and severely disabled, was excited to be there, said Hopper, who has served as Skelton's caregiver for 10 years.
    "He's mobile and real social. He's like a social butterfly and wants to say 'Hi' to everyone," Hopper said. "He was making noises, like 'hey, hey, hey' to the hostess."
    Hopper said the two followed the hostess between the co-owner of Archies, Jim Johnson, and two customers he was talking to.
    "The very nature of the restaurant is when you are seated you have to walk between them," Hopper said.
    Skelton stopped to sign to Johnson that he was really excited to be there and wanted to eat.
    "(Johnson) instantly became angry that he was interrupted," Hopper said.
    Hopper said Johnson told him, "Will you do something about this now?"
    After the two walked over to sit down, Hopper said Johnson told him, "This guy is bad for business, my friend."
    "I thought, OK, I guess he doesn't want us to eat here," Hopper said.
    So the two left for The Breakfast Club.
    Johnson said he was in no way disrespectful to Hopper and Skelton.
    "They walked in and got between two senior customers I was talking to," he said. "I was just starting to say, 'How was your breakfast?' when the young man stepped between the table and me and started making weird grunting noises, grabbing my hand and shaking it. I thought he was either drunk or on PCP."
    He said Skelton stayed in his face with his rear end in the face of the customers.
    Johnson said he did tell Hopper and Skelton that Skelton's behavior wasn't good for business, but he didn't realize Skelton was disabled and just assumed the two would sit down and have breakfast.
    After they finished eating at The Breakfast Club, Hopper called Archie's to talk to the owner about the way he and Skelton were treated.
    Hopper discovered that Johnson was the restaurant's co-owner.
    "I told him that I thought we were treated pretty rudely and he said (Skelton) was rude and for all he knew Dan was drunk," Hopper said.
    Hopper said he then told Johnson that Skelton wasn't drunk, but disabled.
    "He said 'How should I know? He should wear a goddamn sign around his neck,' " Hopper said.
    When Hopper threatened to write a letter to the editor about the incident, Johnson told Hopper he could write two for all he cared.
    "He had plenty of time to say he misunderstood, but he just became enraged again," Hopper said.
    Johnson said he did say those things, but he was provoked.
    "He accused me of being rude and mean-spirited to a mentally handicapped person," Johnson said. "Both the waitress and I witnessed this along with the senior couple and our first impression was that he consumed a large amount of alcohol. (Hopper) said I should have known, but I don't know what signing means. It didn't look like anything in the movies, it was weird gibberish with him slapping himself on the chest or chin."
    Johnson said he indicated that Hopper do his job and gently escort Skelton out of the situation.
    "I thought this never happens, I should at least protest this," Hopper said.
    Hopper and Skelton showed up in Friendship Square on Sunday with yellow signs. They were joined by about 20 other people who had heard about the protest.
    "There were people in there, kids in his restaurant, but (Johnson) stood there for a while and flipped us off," he said.
    Johnson denied making the gesture toward the protestors, although he said he told the protestors to come back again because he had more business than the previous Sunday.
    Hopper said he isn't seeking vengeance.
    "This is just bizarre," he said. "He's starting a restaurant and he needs community support to make a living, but he's not willing to support the community."
    Johnson said the situation has been an absolute nightmare.
    "My friends and employees know in my wildest dreams I would never pull what people are accusing me of," he said. "I've come to Moscow and invested $650,000 in this town. I'm 63 years old, this is my last hurrah. We are busting our hinds for every bit of business so we can have this investment pay off."
    Johnson said no matter what happens, he'll be painted in a negative light.
    "No matter what I say people are going to believe what they want to believe," he said.
    Omie Drawhorn can be reached at(208) 882-5561, ext. 234 or by e-mail at odrawhorn at dnews.com.
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