[Vision2020] Journalistic integrity
Greg Burton
gburton@sltrib.com
Tue, 28 Oct 2003 13:29:23 -0700
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Sunil, it seems clear to me that Miller relied on the same military and
intelligence sources as the Bush Administration did in making its case for
war with Iraq. And, I think Miller's reporting is in fact receiving some of
the same criticism as the Bush Administration. But, that's a very different
situation than Blair's. Blair fabricated information, quotes and yadda yadd=
a
yadda and the Times wrote a massive correction, two editors fell or were
pushed on their swords and the newsroom changed its internal policing
policies.
Miller printed information that she apparently received from sources and
published it as the best information she had at that point in time.
Newspapers aren't history books (Doug W. probably agrees here). Newspapers
do aspire to present everything of importance and of record on the day they
publish. Some of what was published on Tuesday, however, will be proved
wrong on Wednesday =8B even when the journalist did everything right and with
the utmost integrity.
Today, I believe, if you read the Times they will be reporting that no WsM=
D
were found and that intelligence officials screwed up and the British Prime
Minister made mistakes and so on and so on. Hopefully, (30 years from now a=
t
the CC History Conference?), somebody will be discussing all of the
intelligence, good and bad, right and wrong, that led up to the war with
Iraq and the facts as they are known then will see the light of day. As mos=
t
folks know, though, the full truth doesn't always come out, ever, even in
history books.
Anyone care to debate the identity of Deep Throat?
cheers, greg
on 10/28/03 12:47 PM, Sunil Ramalingam at sunilramalingam@hotmail.com wrote=
:
Greg,=20
Last summer when the NYT was being excoriated for the reporting of Jayson
Blair, I thought to myself - well, that's not entirely true, I also blabbed
this at friends - 'Why isn't the same criticism directed at Judith Miller's
reporting on Hussein and WsMD?'
Seems to me both her reporting as well as the decision of the Times to
publish her unconfirmed stories early in the war were abysmal.
Sunil Ramalingam
>From: Greg Burton=20
>To: Douglas ,=20
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Journalistic integrity
>Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 12:05:50 -0700
>=20
> I have been reading this thread, albeit probably only the bottom half,
>with some bemusement. So, I pulled up the Spokesman web copy of the articl=
e
>by daily news scribe Alexis Bacharach. The web version may differ from the
>print version, or even the version that ran in the DNews because different
>editors often make changes later, even from versions shipped whole over th=
e
>AP news wire.=20
>=20
> That being said, the web version today says "the Christ Church-sponsored
>conference in February during which the authors will discuss history and
>slavery." That's not the exact quote Doug W. writes below. And it makes a
>clear distinction. The Spokesman web version of the DNews story also conve=
ys
>the idea that Sanchez believes Wilson and Wilkins "seek to provide a
>biblical defense of slavery" in their book, not that they will do so at th=
e
>"History Conference." Another important distinction.
> My question is will Wilson and Wilkins discuss slavery or will they not?
> If so, the article is accurate in my mind. Many times, too, a journalist
>will get a tip about something, examine the veracity and go with the
>information if they can confirm it elsewhere. Maybe that happened in this
>instance. If not, there should be a simple correction or clarification.
> Further, the "journalistic integrity" slug to this thread is a red
>herring. The New York Times incident was about integrity and ethics, this
>seems more like quibbling.
>=20
>cheers, greg burton
>=20
>on 10/28/03 10:18 AM, Douglas at dougwils@moscow.com wrote:
>=20
> > Visionaries,=20
> >=20
> > The more I meditate on this farrago of nonsense, the more curiouser I g=
et.
> > If I understood Bill London's argument correctly, he is saying that the
> > Daily News did not err in saying that our conference is on slavery beca=
use
> > I co-wrote a booklet with Steve Wilkins on slavery about seven years ag=
o.
> > This means that the conference is also on baptism, the sacraments, and =
the
> > visible/invisible church distinction because I did a conference togethe=
r
> > with Wilkins in 2002 on those very topics. We two must talk about the s=
ame
> > thing every time we appear together, musn't we? No, wait, ACTUALLY the
> > conference is about biblical hospitality because Steve wrote a book on =
that
> > topic that was published by Canon Press, and Canon Press has ties to Ch=
rist
> > Church, which I pastor. By this means, the conference is allowed to be
> > about anything except what the conference brochure says that it is abou=
t.
> >=20
> > Look, this is not difficult. It is not something that should be allowed=
to
> > be politicized. Let me quote. The article as it ran in the Statesman sa=
id
> > that Sanchez decided to research "the Christ Church-sponsored conferenc=
e in
> > February that features the authors discussing history and slavery." Thi=
s is
> > what they call (at real newspapers anyway) a MISTAKE. It is, he explain=
ed
> > further, an ERROR. Not wanting to put to fine a point on it, he
> > nevertheless continued to insist that it is ALL GUMMED UP. This is not,=
as
> > the Daily News muttered into its handkerchief, "incomplete." It is WRON=
G. A
> > strange concept, I know.
> >=20
> > The Daily News really needs to start an Accuracy Be Damned column, so t=
hat
> > they can reiterate their commitments to earlier mistakes.
> >=20
> > Cordially,=20
> >=20
> > Douglas Wilson=20
> >=20
> > _____________________________________________________
> > List services made available by First Step Internet,
> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> > http://www.fsr.net
> > mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com
> > ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????
> >=20
>=20
>_____________________________________________________
> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> http://www.fsr.net
> mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com
>=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF
Never get a busy signal because you are always connected with high-speed
Internet access. Click here to comparison-shop providers.
<http://g.msn.com/8HMBENUS/2728??PS=3D>
_____________________________________________________ List services made
available by First Step Internet, serving the communities of the Palouse
since 1994. http://www.fsr.net
mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com
=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF
Greg Burton, Senior Editor
Social Justice Desk
The Salt Lake Tribune
143 S. Main Street
Salt Lake City, 84111
801-257-8789 office
801-918-8097 cell
801-257-8525 fax
gburton@sltrib.com
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<HTML>
<HEAD>
<TITLE>Re: [Vision2020] Journalistic integrity</TITLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
Sunil, it seems clear to me that Miller relied on the same military =
and intelligence sources as the Bush Administration did in making its case f=
or war with Iraq. And, I think Miller's reporting is in fact receiving some =
of the same criticism as the Bush Administration. But, that's a very differe=
nt situation than Blair's. Blair fabricated information, quotes and yadda ya=
dda yadda and the Times wrote a massive correction, two editors fell or were=
pushed on their swords and the newsroom changed its internal policing polic=
ies.<BR>
Miller printed information that she apparently received from sources=
and published it as the best information she had at that point in time. New=
spapers aren't history books (Doug W. probably agrees here). Newspapers do a=
spire to present everything of importance and of record on the day they publ=
ish. Some of what was published on Tuesday, however, will be proved wrong on=
Wednesday =8B even when the journalist did everything right and with the utmo=
st integrity.<BR>
Today, I believe, if you read the Times they will be reporting that =
no WsMD were found and that intelligence officials screwed up and the Britis=
h Prime Minister made mistakes and so on and so on. Hopefully, (30 years fro=
m now at the CC History Conference?), somebody will be discussing all of the=
intelligence, good and bad, right and wrong, that led up to the war with Ir=
aq and the facts as they are known then will see the light of day. As most f=
olks know, though, the full truth doesn't always come out, ever, even in his=
tory books.<BR>
Anyone care to debate the identity of Deep Throat?<BR>
cheers, greg<BR>
<BR>
on 10/28/03 12:47 PM, Sunil Ramalingam at sunilramalingam@hotmail.com wrote=
:<BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>Greg, <BR>
<BR>
Last summer when the NYT was being excoriated for the reporting of Jayson B=
lair, I thought to myself - well, that's not entirely true, I also blabbed t=
his at friends - 'Why isn't the same criticism directed at Judith Miller's r=
eporting on Hussein and WsMD?' <BR>
<BR>
Seems to me both her reporting as well as the decision of the Times to publ=
ish her unconfirmed stories early in the war were abysmal. <BR>
<BR>
Sunil Ramalingam<BR>
>From: Greg Burton <BR>
>To: Douglas , <BR>
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Journalistic integrity <BR>
>Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 12:05:50 -0700 <BR>
> <BR>
> I have been reading this thread, albeit probably only the bottom half,=
<BR>
>with some bemusement. So, I pulled up the Spokesman web copy of the art=
icle <BR>
>by daily news scribe Alexis Bacharach. The web version may differ from =
the <BR>
>print version, or even the version that ran in the DNews because differ=
ent <BR>
>editors often make changes later, even from versions shipped whole over=
the <BR>
>AP news wire. <BR>
> <BR>
> That being said, the web version today says "the Christ Church-sp=
onsored <BR>
>conference in February during which the authors will discuss history an=
d <BR>
>slavery." That's not the exact quote Doug W. writes below. And it =
makes a <BR>
>clear distinction. The Spokesman web version of the DNews story also co=
nveys <BR>
>the idea that Sanchez believes Wilson and Wilkins "seek to provide=
a <BR>
>biblical defense of slavery" in their book, not that they will do =
so at the <BR>
>"History Conference." Another important distinction. <BR>
> My question is will Wilson and Wilkins discuss slavery or will they no=
t? <BR>
> If so, the article is accurate in my mind. Many times, too, a journali=
st <BR>
>will get a tip about something, examine the veracity and go with the <B=
R>
>information if they can confirm it elsewhere. Maybe that happened in th=
is <BR>
>instance. If not, there should be a simple correction or clarification.=
<BR>
> Further, the "journalistic integrity" slug to this thread is=
a red <BR>
>herring. The New York Times incident was about integrity and ethics, th=
is <BR>
>seems more like quibbling. <BR>
> <BR>
>cheers, greg burton <BR>
> <BR>
>on 10/28/03 10:18 AM, Douglas at dougwils@moscow.com wrote: <BR>
> <BR>
> > Visionaries, <BR>
> > <BR>
> > The more I meditate on this farrago of nonsense, the more curious=
er I get. <BR>
> > If I understood Bill London's argument correctly, he is saying th=
at the <BR>
> > Daily News did not err in saying that our conference is on slaver=
y because <BR>
> > I co-wrote a booklet with Steve Wilkins on slavery about seven ye=
ars ago. <BR>
> > This means that the conference is also on baptism, the sacraments=
, and the <BR>
> > visible/invisible church distinction because I did a conference t=
ogether <BR>
> > with Wilkins in 2002 on those very topics. We two must talk about=
the same <BR>
> > thing every time we appear together, musn't we? No, wait, ACTUALL=
Y the <BR>
> > conference is about biblical hospitality because Steve wrote a bo=
ok on that <BR>
> > topic that was published by Canon Press, and Canon Press has ties=
to Christ <BR>
> > Church, which I pastor. By this means, the conference is allowed =
to be <BR>
> > about anything except what the conference brochure says that it i=
s about. <BR>
> > <BR>
> > Look, this is not difficult. It is not something that should be a=
llowed to <BR>
> > be politicized. Let me quote. The article as it ran in the States=
man said <BR>
> > that Sanchez decided to research "the Christ Church-sponsore=
d conference in <BR>
> > February that features the authors discussing history and slavery=
." This is <BR>
> > what they call (at real newspapers anyway) a MISTAKE. It is, he e=
xplained <BR>
> > further, an ERROR. Not wanting to put to fine a point on it, he <=
BR>
> > nevertheless continued to insist that it is ALL GUMMED UP. This i=
s not, as <BR>
> > the Daily News muttered into its handkerchief, "incomplete.&=
quot; It is WRONG. A <BR>
> > strange concept, I know. <BR>
> > <BR>
> > The Daily News really needs to start an Accuracy Be Damned column=
, so that <BR>
> > they can reiterate their commitments to earlier mistakes. <BR>
> > <BR>
> > Cordially, <BR>
> > <BR>
> > Douglas Wilson <BR>
> > <BR>
> > _____________________________________________________ <BR>
> > List services made available by First Step Internet, <BR>
> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994. <BR>
> > http://www.fsr.net <BR>
> > mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com <BR>
> > ????????????????????????????????????????????????????? <BR>
> > <BR>
> <BR>
>_____________________________________________________ <BR>
> List services made available by First Step Internet, <BR>
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994. <BR>
> http://www.fsr.net <BR>
> mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com <BR>
>=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF <BR>
<BR>
<HR ALIGN=3DCENTER SIZE=3D"3" WIDTH=3D"100%"><BR>
Never get a busy signal because you are always connected with high-s=
peed Internet access. Click here to comparison-shop providers. <http://g.=
msn.com/8HMBENUS/2728??PS=3D> _______________________________________=
______________ List services made available by First Step Internet, serving =
the communities of the Palouse since 1994. http://www.fsr.net &n=
bsp; =
mailto:Vision2020@mosc=
ow.com =AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF=AF <BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
Greg Burton, Senior Editor<BR>
Social Justice Desk<BR>
The Salt Lake Tribune<BR>
143 S. Main Street<BR>
Salt Lake City, 84111<BR>
801-257-8789 office<BR>
801-918-8097 cell<BR>
801-257-8525 fax<BR>
gburton@sltrib.com<BR>
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